A simple way of identifying good doctors
Finding the right #doctor is the biggest challenge #patients face. How can you be sure he is competent ? trustworthy ? Doctor rating sites have not been very helpful so far, because they suffer from a lot of shortcomings.
A simple option would be to create a website and ask doctors which doctors they go to when their own family member falls ill ! This would be very valuable, as we can assume that doctors have inside information, and will be careful about which doctors they select for the treatment of their own loved ones !
Do you think this would work ? ,
Will they give honest feedback or will they simply cross promote each other through references? The same problem exists in LinkedIn within their skills endorsement feature even tough the intent was good.
Yes, always a risk, and we may need a way of verifying this.
Nops, no offence, buy then doctors would start internal referral cycle where in a set of doctors would cross refer patients to each other.
yes, I agree. But by then, damage would have been done and people trust would not be there in the system. And it would be really difficult to regain that. So if we want to build this system, it has to be perfect and technology and driven. And we need to make sure we handle these kind of issues and also scrutinize the things. Blacklist anybody who play foul games.
Dr Aniruddha Malpani Concept is good, but approach is not appropriate as it can be easily gamed like someone has rightly pointed out. There is heavy give and take on medical industry. It’s pure business.
This method will work most of the time for selecting a good doctor but not for choosing affordable treatment.
Hope the doctor will give right answer to the question.
I would trust patients experience & then all doctors on online platforms.
Best way to get Best doctor is to ask few patients feedback & chemists feedback too.
Dr Aniruddha Malpani
Indeed #1 resource
Dr Aniruddha Malpani Nobody lives in a vacuum. Nurses are also part of the system. Everyone has their own agenda, right from the pharmacist to the hospital and the manufacturers.
I was thinking exactly the same when there was a discussion going on in one of the groups; I think a platform where views, reviews are submitted by patients or the relatives on whatever treatment will provide a better viewpoint and onus on patients to select where to go.
Intent is the problem ..few concern already raised..I believe patient ratings are good indicator as same doc can behave differently with other doc and actual patient..I know few friends who left the doc because of attitude not skills…it’s not relevant here but we are bringing few local partners on our platform where our customer can go and get some discounts/offers/priority etc…this is not for making money from those partners but to create better customer relations for our services..we do not have ratings here..but if we put ratings probably those ratings may be better indicator as we don’t have purpose to skew that..also these ratings can only be given by our real customers..just a thought..
Yes, it’s a difficult problem to solve. Most patients judge doctors by their bedside manner, and not their clinical competence, because they aren’t competent enough to judge the doctor’s technical skills, and they naively assume all doctors are equally good
Why not a weighted average rating arrived by using inputs from all sources – doctors, nurses and patients?
We can assign a higher weight to a doctor recommending another doctor (with the weightage attached to his recommendation in turn linked to his own rating – a highly reputed doctors recommendation gotta count for more), slightly lower weight for nurses and then lowest for patients. We can this way capture the wisdom of the crowds by accounting for all the different segments and the associated value of their recommendations.
Dr Aniruddha Malpani That is correct. It’s a chicken and egg problem and the ratings are not going to be useful until there is a critical mass of submissions.
This is probably the reason why Practo retracted their ratings feature shortly after its initial launch. One way I can think a platform can incentivise users is to offer a free appointment with any doctor through its platform for a user who files a review + rating (irrespective of the nature of the review/rating). Once the review is filed the platform generates a unique redeemable voucher code over email that can be used when booking their next doctor appointment whenever it is. The platform should in turn internally negotiate a deal with the individual doctors who are interested in getting rated. Doctors who are willing to offer a free/subsidised consultation against a review/rating can let the platform know with a cap on how many such free consultations they might be willing to entertain.
This offer can be run for a certain defined period until the critical mass of ratings have been received and the ratings actually become meaningful. Once the network effect kicks in, people will be happy to add further for free (like Zomato, Amazon) for collective good.
Don’t do that. The moment you incentivize people for review, the honesty goes for a toss. Then it is all about how to get more benefits. by gaming the system.
I am sure this will not work..
Damodar Tekchandani Most doctors are straight forward people who will not lie when asked a simple direct question such as – Who is your child’s pediatrician?
Dr Aniruddha Malpani If most doctors were straight forward, there wouldn’t be syndicates running between labs, medical stores, pharmaceutical companies..Plus all the specialists would not charge their fees in cash to avoid paying service tax on professional fees..Also they would refuse to accept targets of money collection given to them by management of sophisticated hospitals..Hope you must be aware of unfair trade practices going on in the medical profession.
Dear Dr Malpani
As a first step , you will need to define what do you expect as ‘Good’ when you mention Good doctor.
Patients may attach N number of attributes as Good , like : Experience, Qualification, Institution studied, part of a research team, location proximity, language, ease of communication, per patient time, pricing, quick diagnosis, number of referring doctors, word of mouth, known to a relative or friend……..
At Eminent Physicians USA, we faced a similar challenge in defining ‘Eminence’ while working with top doctors in USA . it took 2.5 years and 40 researchers to ‘profile over 90K doctors in USA . We could find that only 0.3% of doctors could fit into profile of ‘Eminence’ based upon our criteria.
The whole exercise helped us prove our point and it became easy to convince leading hospitals worldwide about the core value that we are delivering now to leading hospitals in over 11 countries.
If any of the readers wishes to view profile of such doctors, please message me at LinkedIn . I will be happy to share by email or whatsapp.
Nah, it would backfire. Patients within a doctor’s family are most neglected anyways. Also most doctors are so so consumed in their own practise, they only know their batch mates and few doctors they socialise with and would go to them.
Doctors have their own private standing in the medical community, and doctors are better positioned to find a doctor’s doctor when a family member is ill
Nope. Good & dedicated doctors are super busy. They are better positioned for sure but do they have the bandwidth to use that positioning, no I don’t think so. I am from a family of doctors. I have seen it first hand. And coming to the original post of making a website and asking doctors. Again, I haven’t met a single good general physician, paediatrician, ortho who has the time for this.
Rating only works on objective and well defined use cases
Medical profession is more of business in India as its not regulated
You will have to think differently
Dr Aniruddha Malpani So do you intend to say NTS are a mirror to the technical skill set??or can be extrapolated to judge technical skills ??
No – but they often do go hand in hand, and good doctors take pride in both their technical skills, as well as their bedside manner !
Sir it will become orkut then… I will write testimonials for you and you write it for me…
why orkut. happens on linkedin also. seen it on many large corporations and some start ups too
What is your definition of “good”??
sensible
Interesting idea
But what is the incentive for doctors to publicly announce that on a website?
No direct benefit, that’s true. Maybe one way of showing their gratitude to the doctor who is treating them?
I completely agree with # Simantika G… Please brief the definition of GOOD!!!
No….academically good physician with ethics will position himself differently. Money minded Branding physicians have different Patient luring strategy. Trust comes when your treatment gives results. Line of demarcation is very thin when Money becomes priority and quality treatment becomes secondary.
Absolutely right
Biggest Challenge for healthcare seekers@patients would be finding Quality Medical services.
Positive minded people in IBM have worked on IBM WATSON which uses Cognitive computing to give an insight of all the diagnostic information which doctor’s can use to treat patients effectively. Making all the Doctors efficient is better than doing PH.D on who treats better.
Yes, there should be an independent agency (say the govt) doing an NPS survey of all doctors and hospitals, and make the results public.
@Simantika : The price of Mis diagnosis is HUGE, for the patient and their FAMILIES. other industries don’t have the same problem.
Suraj Jethwani agreed…but I would personally like to know the rating of the cab driver before I board the cab..pilot before I board the plane..coz I love my life too?
I think it’s a great idea. Especially it maybe useful to specialties that the public are generally unaware of.
Good Friday Morning. Interesting and I am willing to lead this idea and convert into an online “Medical Review” application. Any investors here?
Why not create a website first, get traction, and then ask for investments ?
Dr. Sahib- I am not “asking” for any investments..I asked for “investors” which includes Doctors like you willing to sign-up and promote this website with your customers. Will you help getting the first 5000 doctors on-board?
Really its a great idea… a doctor can only think like that…
I speak with Doctors in the Family, Friend circle before deciding who to Consult for my Dad. But as you said this is “Inside Information” – generally shared in closed circles.
Besides what prevents the “Money-minded” to pimp each other. Practically, it has the same issues as any other Review system which can be gamed. Maybe we can learn from Amazon’s “Verified Buyer” to reduce the gaming ?
🙂
Definitely Sir. indeed.
No doctors won’t share this critical info about other doctors
I would expect that they would be happy to praise and compliment the doctors they take their own family members to !
I once asked a doctor as to which doctors does he go to. There was no reply but a faint smile. The writing on the wall is clear. They have acquaintances of various specialities in various places. I don’t think I ever needed to ask again. Thanks.
Interesting Idea indeed!
But before this we need to break down what this ‘inside information’ really is.
Is it a score of peer opinion? Would competitors be ready to recommend each other instead of themselves? If not there would only be cross specialty reviews, which would be only a step ahead of patient reviews and lose objectivity.
Also, in theory, if such a system is in place which monetizes peer opinion it is very hard to assume that reviews would be completely genuine.
According to choice theories, in absence of real objective data or the absence of ability of data’s interpretation we look for ‘clues’ (cleanliness, experience, grandness, media etc) for making decisions and according to a NHS study these often turn out to be correct choice in statistical probability.
Another interesting take would be – What would be marginal outcome gain per peer review score? But such a system might have an emotional selling point as it concerns with safety.
The real indicators of better outcomes instead are – number of surgeries one has performed over similar cases. But no one really is ready to part with such data. 🙂
That could be one option indeed. But it is akin to changing behaviour of pattern of healthcare consumption. If we look at current decision making pattern for healthcare consumption it is mostly through past personal experience, recommendations of friends and family and referral by primary physician. (Changing behaviour of people is so tough). Though some form of information is available on the internet about the quality of doctors, in my research it is not widely consumed for critical decision making.
Another view of this would be – Will people really be able to consume complex data. Taking a cue out of US healthcare startups in similar domain, where healthcare outcomes data is publicly available and there are a couple of startups which compile that data and present it to patient for better decision making. These solutions are not too popular as one would hope they would be. The most immediate inference indicates deviation in information presented and information consumed.
Though one can never be sure what works until one tries!
Agreed. While most people are happy with their doctor, when you have a serious or complex illness, or when you are unhappy with your current doctor, people will move heaven and earth to find the right doctor, and they are able to consume complex data in order to reach their goal. Yes, this is a small number, but for them , this information is extremely valuable
Good idea but this would assume the answers would be axxurate and not based on who they would want to refer to. It would be more accurate, though more complicated to track where they go themselves and where their families go. This would be hard due to privacy issues.
Accurate*
Dr Aniruddha Malpani yes but certainly great thought CAHPS and other rating tools are not well equipped to provide informative information to patients or decision makers – would love to see something more accurate being used.
Dr Aniruddha Malpani I do not agree with this idea. No doubt idea is great but cannot be implemented. Reasons doctors (fertility experts) like you may share your physician details than too you would be hesitant as you might have other physician friends. You will not get your relations spoiled just to share information with people and that too for free. Why anyone would spoil relationships?
The way I see it, is that potential issue could be overcome by making the recommending doctor’s identity anonymous and the network being developed as an aggregate of recommendations versus just one or a small size of physicians. This would also make the recommendations stronger, statistically and clinically.
I agree there are issues with the idea, but I think they can be solved. Perhaps by starting with a focused specialty?
I think there is a peer rating site already up – some people have requested reviews and while I know Simeone who got Gold, Platinum status etc., I am not sure it actually is truthful. You see the ratings is only as strong as the sample. To have a truthful rating, you would need a right depth and size sample which unless deeply penetrated is additional work and is just Doc friends doing quid pro quo so not really a truthful rating.
True. Will need work to add depth and veracity
This idea is a fallacy in my opinion. Since doctors know that that their ratings are going to be taken in decision making of patients, they will boost their votes for themselves on the website. Excluding their names is an obvious option. But still there is no way to check whether doctor ‘s are posting their genuine interests or trying to game up their co-clinic doctors.
Would be possible to put checks in place I believe
absolutely & with technology
Ravinder Bhan
It’s a great idea.
But I would seriously doubt the doctors giving a non partisan opinion about a fellow professional. It has a danger of becoming a cartel of you scratch my back and I will scratch yours.
Customer (patient will be the king here)
An idea thats worth exploration in depth. It would be a tough act to implement and accrue critical mass required for veracity. Geographical limitations will come into play, in getting the numbers required, if its exclusively peer-to-peer. I would think a global review platform with varying weightage on ratings (patient>professional>specialist) based on block chain, could work.
A patient driven rating system for doctors is the most independent one. However the data can be manipulated, if it is not with an independent, audit-able and transparent authority.
Cartels do work in India, inspite of the fact that doctors per capita in our country is low with poor distribution/availability.
Very true!
Really appreciate raising this issue. Docdoc, a Web portal Co-founded by Grace Park is helping solve this exact problem. I wish this service existed when, as a parents, we went through the challenge of finding the right doctor for life changing surgery for my infant son many years ago. The best rated for a certain procedure may not be the best for you as a family.
Rajesh Wadhwa [LION] You are right, it isn’t a run of the mill rating site. Doctors are members of the platform. The platform ensures that member doctors see qualified patients while patients receive transparent information (sometime on upto 300 counts) about the doctor to make an informed choice.
Kavita Sinha so are we not back to the root question of this thread? A doctor’s billboard is surely not as authentic it could/should be…
Doctors won’t write at all or very few will write. Why? they all know the risks..
Many ventures are trying to use technology so as to take advantage of information in Healthcare in India. What we really need is to exploit all resources as these are limited. What will work is seem less flow of patient from primary to secondary to tertiary care as per their health status and need. This is only possible in a country like India if resources are connected and private parties are not scared of losing business but are focused on right kind of patients they should be treating and then referring those that need additional care. Off course private insurance will play a great role in all this.
All people who would like to invest in such ventures, please do not look at the current incremental value the idea can create but the possible paradigm shift it can bring to healthcare. That should be the measure of it.
But if you run out of money while trying to create a paradigm shift, you end up in the graveyard of failures which litter the healthcare space ?
Dr Aniruddha Malpani yes real change will need big money but can be started small if the vision remains intact. Anyway there are lot of other opportunities like this peer rating. Best wishes.
It’s not based on doctor billboard information but verified data points including experience for Doctor discovery. As a user, haven’t come across similar services.
Why do you think I have any influence over doctors ? Like everyone else, doctors will do what they feel is their own best interests !
Dr Aniruddha Malpani i did not mean that you have an influence “over” the doctors; rather you are an influencer in general considering your experience in this industry plus you as an angel investor surely commands respect.
With this concept I am pretty much sure that MBBS doctor’s will be hired on payroll by Phd’s to work for them as sales force. Soon forming Speciality Ailments Companies within their respective field. BTW it can be easily termed as influencer marketing in medicare.
not a good idea as doctors will never comment on thier own kind
Yes, I feel this can be Zomato for health care industry. Experts reviewing experts.
was working on a similar concept, if interested, we connect and discuss.
Yes Sir.. But the problem will still remain..you right about rating sites,most of reviews are paid ones.May be MCI can publish a list..most imp is second opinion sites and diagnostic centres who dont have to give kick backs.. There was one site choose doctor which is closed it seems.
Good Morning Everyone. I am willing to lead this initiative and be the tech lead to design and develop a platform for doctor’s ratings and reviews. Would anyone volunteer here to be my marketing partner to get the 1st 1000 doctors on board?
Shiv Bhasin
what’s wrong with Practo? they do have the feedback tab for doctors on board… Shiv Bhasin